‘whose ONLY “morality” was preserving the power of the land owning aristocracy that just wanted to maintain the Republic as their own personal cashbox.’

Firstly, implying that Caesar was against this behaviour by the upperclasses, which he most certainly was not.
Secondly, you cannot possibly have read anything saying Cato was not a moral individual because every written work mentioning him is very clear about how shockingly upright he was in every regard, except if I remember correctly that he often got drunk, so I don’t know where you are getting it from.

The question is whether team Caesar or Cato is better, with that context. > “I’m on team Cato” > Fuck that! This may not have been your intention but it sounds like in that post you are disagreeing with me, and by that saying you are on team Caesar. Ok, so you just don’t like any of them, that’s fine, but you have nothing against Cato specifically, just a general opinion of Roman society? If your problem is with Plutocratic loyalty, I assume you just hate every notable Roman figure that could be named. If you do hate every Roman… Read more »

‘That’s not the question to ME!’ I mean, it may or may not be to you, but I made the post in response to the podcast and that was the question. ‘fight a deadly civil war to defend that plutocratic system!’ But both sides supported that same system, very clearly that’s not what the war was about. ‘Not any more radical than the Gracchi!’ Their situation is very sympathetic to our ideology but you are somewhat removing the nuance from their legacy by bring them up against Cato who was either very young or not born at the time. ‘Cato… Read more »

> Optimates faction
> Populares faction
You are completely misunderstanding the nature of the ‘factions’ which is majorly overblown by popular historians.
> ‘clear class aspect to that civil war.’
Horseshit, you don’t know anything about this.

> wanting to set himself up as king!
Yes but unlike with the other case, they were totally correct. Sic semper tyrannis.

> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
What primary source do you have which shows the existence of some political party or ideological faction within the senate along the lines of pro people and pro upper class?

You wont find it because it doesn’t fucking exist, the grouping is heavily disputed (to say it mildly) recent historical conjecture. You are speaking from out your ass and you aren’t even doing a good job bluffing.

So no primary sources? Because you haven’t read them or they don’t agree with you?
“Historians say something I don’t like therefore wrong!’
As I said, they don’t say it, whatever shitty 300 page pop history you have read has said it.

‘CLEAR class factions’ Which had no relevance to Caesar and Cato since they were both on the same side of that divide. You are the one who brought up ‘optimates’ and ‘populares’ so I don’t know how those are my parameters. ‘In other words:“Historians say something I don’t like therefore wrong!’’ Fuck of psued. ‘ I do seem to remember some comment about the optimates by Cicero’ But naturally you haven’t read CIcero, as I actually have, all 6,000,000 fucking pages of it, or you would know what he meant by that. Go furiously control F some more wikipedia pages and… Read more »

‘Go ahead and show me where I said “political party” or “ideological faction” or “the senate”’

‘The supporters of Pompey’s side in the war were overwhelmingly the Optimates faction and were clearly afraid they were going to lose their social positions. The supporters of Caesar were overwhelmingly from the Populares faction. That shows a clear class aspect to that civil war.’
Go weasal out of your words.

‘Why should I believe anything you say after your manipulative statement?’
Believe what you want retard.

Oh the times, oh the morals.
‘Ohh gaaaawwwddd, I didn’t say those exact worrrrrrrrrds. When I saaaaiiiiidd Optimate faction who had an ideological position and were in the senate and populares who were a faction in the senate that doesn’t mean aaaaannnnyyyything.’

I speak nothing but the truth.

Caracalla was 1/2 Arab, and 1/4th other Semitic or something similar, I think whichever emperor his dad was was half Italian.

I’m checking my Cassius Dio and i’m reasonably sure that he wasn’t of Roman colonists, give me a few minutes.